6 Comments Criticizing the Position of “Election” in the Bible Exalted
Below are 6 comments criticizing the position of "election" in EBF's "The Bible Exalted! Free Will vs. Election" program. A few of the responders are attacking Calvin (who was not mentioned nor quoted by the panelists) and completely ignore discussion or explanation for the Scriptures that declare salvation is NOT of the will of man.
Comment #1: In 1 Peter 1, Peter says to make our calling and election sure. We have s free will to except or reject.
EBF reply:
What comes immediately after that statement? Here's the verse in context:
Philippians 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
God commands to "work out your own salvation" and then instantly tells us how that is accomplished: "For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure".
The reference to God's good pleasure is, of course, significant:
Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
God's chosen (His elect) were predestinated "according to the good pleasure of His will". Which "will" thereby works within those same blessed chosen few (many are called but few are chosen-Matthew 22:14) to cause them to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling.
No matter how man tries to make an end run around the true Gospel of the Bible – the Word of God stops him at every turn. Man is dead in sin and as a result can do nothing when it comes to the salvation of God except be the dead spiritual corpse that is acted upon – and only then if he was one of God's chosen people.
Comment #2: “JESUS THE CREATOR.. NEVER ..takes away our FREE will :——thus- NO one -can EVER..shake their finger..at GOD, declaring ‘you NEVER gave mea chance to be saved’ ;…”
EBF reply:
What about when someone dies? How well does their free will operate then?
What did God warn Adam concerning eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil? God told him in the day he ate thereof he would surely die (literally dying you will die in the Hebrew). Did Adam die that day? Not physically, he didn't. As a matter of fact, Adam lived to be 930 years old.
Did God tell him the truth when He said if you eat of the that one particular tree you will die? Most certainly, God told him the truth. God cannot lie.
How are we to understand it then? We understand what happened to Adam once we realize that Adam and Eve died in their soul existence (their spirit):
Ezekiel 18:4 ...the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Adam and Eve died in their souls that day. They became spiritually dead. And since they were the progenitors of the human race, all of their descendants were also born spiritually dead:
Ephesians 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Unfortunately, multitudes of "Christians" in the churches have no idea of the true fallen nature of mankind. They have no idea of the damage that sin has done to the sinner. They act as though man's fall was like a mild wound of some kind rather than the death blow that it actually was.
If anyone wants to see the true salvation plan of God in the Bible, read John 11 when Jesus approaches the grave of the dead stinking corpse of Lazarus. A man dead for 4 days already. Could Lazarus hear Christ on his own? No. He was dead and the dead cannot hear. Could Lazarus have decided to choose Christ and be turned from death to life? Obviously not. Lazarus was dead and the dead cannot choose anything because they are dead.
Certainly Lazarus had to play some role in the process of his restoration to life. What was Lazarus' part to play?
Lazarus did play a critical role in his restoration to life. Just as all who become saved play a critical role – which is the part of a dead stinking corpse. So dead and stinking that God gets Himself great glory by raising him to life. To God be the glory (not man).
Proud men desperately want to contribute to their salvation. Yet, God made it abundantly clear that man is to do no work of any kind or make any contribution of any kind to his/her salvation. Anyone who thinks they contribute the least bit of work is like the man in the wilderness who picked up a few sticks on the Sabbath day. God's penalty for violating His Sabbath was to have the man stoned to death.
The 7th day Sabbath illustrated the truth that Christ does all the work in saving sinners (Lazarus come forth!) and that the sinner himself can do nothing.
Comment #3: Free Will versus election is deceptive and invalid. People who believe in Free Will are not against election, they're against the Calvinist perversion of the doctrine of election and free will.
EBF reply:
You want the discussion to move away from the Bible to Calvin – no, you need the discussion to move away from the Bible to Calvin – because you must at all costs avoid the Scriptures themselves. Calvin was not brought up by the panel. Only Bible verses like these:
John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
John 15:6 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you,...
Romans 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Don't divert. Answer them. This is the Word of God. A true child of God does not weave and bob away from the truth of God's Word – but faces every verse.
Comment #4: I watched about 20 minutes of the video and the panel is comprised of four people all of whom are arguing for the Calvinist position. What's the point of a discussion in which all the participants already agree with each other?
EBF reply:
The program opened up the phone lines to take anyone's call. People with the free will viewpoint were encouraged to call in. And could still call in during a future program (next live program is Tuesday at 2 pm ET) which is live streamed on our YouTube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/@Ebiblefellowship
Comment #5: Question… for all you …” INABILITY/DETERMINISTS…” Did you FORCE ya wife to marry you…??? Or did God make that Decision for you…??? Oh that is B4 You were ever born/B4 The foundation of the world… of course…!!!… if man has Nooooo…” FREE WILL…” That makes Christ the Author of our….” FAITH & our… FILTH…” Heb.12:2… Who caused Lucifer to Rebel against his Creator…??? who caused Adam & Eve to Rebel against their…Creator…??? who caused The entire population of the world save 8 to Rebel against against their Creator by refusing to get on that Ark…FOR 120 yrs i might add,..,!!! & FINALLY WHO causes us today to SIN & REBEL Against our Creator….??? There can be ONLY ONE OF TWO CORRECT ANSWERS 1. The Creator…or 2. The Creature… There’s Noooooo 3rd …,” CHOICE…” Hmmmmmm can ya say….” CHOICE…” to a Calvinist….??? W/O Committing Sin against their Sacred ( SOLA SCRIPTURA )…WESTMINSTER CONFESSIONS OF….” FAITH…” That are NOT INSPIRED BY GOD BY THE WAY….!!! Hey anything of this getting thru those Little Blue Bonnets…??? Or am i being tooooooo vague…???.. C’mon Spit it out… CREATOR Or CREATURE…??? There’s Noooooo 3rd Choice…!!!!
EBF reply:
The subject matter had to do with free will to choose Christ and become saved. What you need to address is how the sinner can exercise his "will" in a spiritually dead condition. If you want to make a comparison – go to your local cemetery and preach to those in the graves. See how long it will be before they rise up to accept Christ. Why, you say, that would be a waste of time since those in the graves are all dead. And we know that the dead have no ears to hear. Nor eyes to see. Nor any life force to rise up in response – because they are dead. Exactly.
Ephesians 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Actual salvation requires a miracle performed by God Himself – just as Jesus commanded the stinking corpse Lazarus to come forth! And Lazarus came forth. So too must Christ command the dead soul of a sinner to arise and move towards Christ. And just like Lazarus the dead stinking corpse of the sinner's soul can do nothing of its own until he is acted upon by Christ. This is the true gospel of the Bible that gives God all the glory. And be sure that God will not share His glory with another (any proud man claiming he contributed something to his salvation by accepting Christ).
Comment #6: With Calvin, you have no assurance of salvation: Calvin says: 3:21:5 "All are not created on equal terms, but some are preordained to eternal life, others to eternal damnation; and accordingly as each has been created for one or the other of these ends, we say that he has been predestinated to life or death." Calvin teaches that some reprobate may receive a similar inner witness (as the Elect) actually experiencing the grace of God to such an extent that they imagine themselves to be of the Elect. But since they are not, God (as Calvin believed) has no intention that their experience of His grace shall endure. From the outset, His intention is that they shall wither away and die. Calvin: "Thus we dispose of the objection that if God truly displays His grace, it must endure forever. There is nothing inconsistent in this with the fact of his enlightening some with a present sense of grace, which afterwards proves evanescent...There is nothing strange in God's shedding some rays of grace on the reprobate, and afterwards allowing these to be extinguished." 3:2:11, 12. Those rays of grace you currently enjoy could be extinguished at any moment. Don't blame me, Calvin said it.
EBF reply:
No one quoted Calvin. Calvin didn't write this:
John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, NOR OF THE WILL OF MAN, but of God.
God wrote it by moving the writer of Scripture to write it down. Just like God (not Calvin) wrote this:
Romans 9:16 So then it is NOT OF HIM THAT WILLETH, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
The free will gospel is a false gospel.